Rhett McLaughlin, co-creator with Link of Good Mythical Morning, talked with atheist Alex O’Connor about his deconstruction from the Christian faith. They discussed a variety of topics, ranging from when Rhett began to believe in evolution to his denial of the claims regarding Jesus’s resurrection, ultimately leading him to abandon his Christian faith.
However, I want to highlight three moments that stood out. I believe these timestamped moments peel back Rhett’s heart, revealing the importance of recognizing the human side and building rapport with people who no longer believe in Christianity.
First Moment: Living a life of meaning rather than pleasure
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The first part of the conversation I’d like to touch on is Rhett’s emphasis on the emptiness resulting from excessive and hedonistic living.
Here’s what Rhett had to say,
“A human that is simply focusing on pleasures … like that [will] ultimately end up just being empty pretty quickly. That’s just a universal truth … so now as someone who doesn’t really know what I think about God, I still recognize like the emptiness of a place like Las Vegas…”
Did you catch that?
Even after leaving his Christian beliefs, Rhett still acknowledges this sense of emptiness, which he believes is a universal experience not tied to any specific faith. We can find common ground here because Romans teaches us that God has placed His truth and morality in our hearts (2:15).
This is very insightful regarding Rhett’s desire to live a life not focused on pursuing pleasure and indulgence, which he clearly points out is unfulfilling. Rhett wants to live with purpose and meaning, filling his life with service to others and pursuing a life that matters.
We can often get caught up in winning the argument or disproving Rhett’s deconstruction, which can cause us to miss their story and overlook what we have in common. Staying curious and avoiding defensiveness will go a long way in building relationships with those you may disagree with.
Second moment: Double standard of Christian apologists
This part of the conversation exposes some of Rhett’s hurt and distaste for what he calls “professional” Christians.
Here’s what he says, “I just find it so interesting the way these Christian apologists go so hard trying to prove it. Do you really believe that is going to be the [way] that changes somebody’s mind?”
I agree with Alex and Rhett that we, as Christian apologists, need to extend grace and be more relatable than cerebral — there are certainly some apologists I know who fit that description. That said, I believe many of my Christian apologist friends aren’t so hard-nosed on the facts that they come off as off-putting, as Alex and Rhett confidently assert. Just to be clear. I’m not implying that Alex and Rhett believe all of us apologists are just a bunch of arrogant intellects trying to prove them wrong.
To defend the faith, winning arguments isn’t enough. What genuinely counts in apologetics, and what enhances its effectiveness, is the alignment of the apologist’s character with the clear teachings and actions of Christ. Pete Bocchino rightly points out, “the degree to which we can serve Christ is contingent upon the degree to which we surrender ourselves to Him.” Notice that, according to Peter, before we can give an answer, we first need to ensure that we “sanctify the Lord God in our hearts” (1 Peter 3:15).
I know many in the apologetics ministry who answer people’s most inquisitive questions with grace and truth and have helped so many who have had negative church experiences, rather than argue with them or be consumed with being right.
Third moment: The need to defend Jesus
As Alex wrapped up the podcast, he naturally asked Rhett where his relationship with Christianity stands today. Surprisingly, Rhett responded by saying,
“There’s a fascination with it that I think is just a natural inclination … I would be lying if I didn’t say it was an essential part of who I am. I think there will always [be] this fascination with Jesus … I almost feel this compulsion to defend the person of Jesus from the way He is used, especially in America.”
I appreciate Rhett’s vulnerability here. He talks about how he doesn’t just toss aside everything he learned from Christianity. Instead, he admits that many of his morals stem from his past beliefs, even when he feels the need to defend Jesus against those who twist His message for their own agendas.
It is commendable that Rhett cares enough to stand up for the person of Jesus. So, rather than immediately cornering Rhett about who he believes Jesus is, the kind and wise approach is to ask him why he still feels a “compulsion” to defend Jesus. I’m curious to know why that is exactly the case.
Once I’ve listened to Rhett’s reasoning and personal reflection, I will then ask what he says about Jesus to “defend” him from those he believes have hijacked him.
It certainly breaks my heart to hear Rhett vividly recount how his doubts, loneliness, and frustrations eventually led to his no longer believing in Christianity. What Rhett shared and how he discussed his de-conversion from Christianity caused me to reflect on my own intentionality in befriending and building rapport with guys like Rhett.
Instead of focusing solely on finding flaws in Rhett’s arguments, let’s shift our perspective to embrace the opportunity for meaningful conversations. It’s great that he’s open to exploring these topics, and this serves as a wonderful starting point for constructive dialogue. We can gain valuable insights from his perspective while sharing our faith as we connect with one another along the way.
